Positive Disintegration
Positive Disintegration Podcast
The Highs and Lows of Positive Disintegration

The Highs and Lows of Positive Disintegration

Join hosts Emma Nicholson and Chris Wells for Episode 17 with Elizabeth Mika

In episode 17, Chris and Emma were joined by Elizabeth Mika, a Polish-born psychologist and expert on the Theory of Positive Disintegration. Elizabeth shares how she first became interested in Dabrowski’s theory as a teenager in Poland, how it inspired her to go into the field of psychology, and her journey into working with the theory once she immigrated to America.

Our conversation covered a wide range of topics, focused on the ‘lows and highs’ of Dabrowski’s levels, from the sub-levels of unilevel integration to the Fourth Factor and drive for self-transcendence. We talk about the dangers of narcissism and its various forms, the role of positive maladjustment, and how self-reflection and inner transformation is the first step in making the world a better place.

“We need to look within before we start changing the world. The greatest gift we can give to the world is our transformed self.”

This is the image we discussed with Elizabeth around minute 31 from her 2018 Dabrowski Congress slideshow. See the resource list below to download her slides.

“Self-education is about personality development on the ever higher levels. Its highest goals is in the natural dimension the fullness of humanity, and in the supranatural dimension – becoming God-like. Self-education should go hand in hand with introspection, and those two activities should become one effort, lasting a lifetime, to come close to the ideal.” 

Resources Mentioned in this Episode

Tyranny as a Triumph of Narcissism (article on Medium)

On Primary Integration, Psychopathy and the Average Person (article on LinkedIn)

Sudden Dynamic Insight: Moving from Conflict to Peace (PDF)

What Disintegrates? (PDF)

Pathocracy and Andrzej Łobaczewski (by Dr. Steve Taylor for Psychology Today )

Follow Elizabeth on Twitter

*A transcript of this episode is available on our website.

Connect with us!

Positive Disintegration on Substack

Visit the Dabrowski Center website



The Positive Disintegration YouTube Channel

Adults with Overexcitabilities group on Facebook

Dabrowski Center and Positive Disintegration Podcast Community on Facebook

The Tragic Gift blog by Emma

Email us at positivedisintegration.pod@gmail.com

Please consider supporting the podcast to help fund this work through the Dabrowski Center, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization.

Find Positive Disintegration Merch

If you enjoyed this episode on Apple or Spotify, please remember to click on the stars and leave a rating or write a review. Thank you! <3

Please share with others who would appreciate learning about Positive Disintegration.


Positive Disintegration
Positive Disintegration Podcast
What can be positive about disintegration? Join us for an exploration of positive disintegration through conversation and shared stories. It’s a framework for understanding a variety of intense experiences that often look and feel like mental illness, but which can also be viewed as building blocks for creating an authentic personality.